Episode 13: The Big 3 of USAPL Leadership

Josh Rohr: welcome back to the USA Power Lifting Podcast. It's been a minute, but we're back. we are joined today by the president of USA Power Lifting, Paulie Steinman. What's up, Paulie? Paulie: What's up, man? Josh Rohr: The vice president of USA Powerlifting, Joe Warpeha, Joe Warpeha: Hello? Josh Rohr: and the Executive Director of USA Powerlifting, Heather Faas Heather Faas: Hey. Josh Rohr: I've decided to start calling you the big three. Paulie: Great. Josh Rohr: Does that sound fair? Heather Faas: Okay. I like it. Josh Rohr: Okay. Paulie: if you're gonna do that then then you're gonna have to go deeper and say who is squat, who is deadlift and who is bench press. Josh Rohr: I haven't haven't thought that far ahead, so next time. Paulie: Well, there you go. Listen, you don't have to may maybe maybe we let we let the world decide. or maybe maybe there's always one of us who's the least favorite lift and the most favorite lift. And I think that that go that cuts across for all power lifters, unless the unless they're unless they're bench only. But so that's Heather Faas: Joe's a bench guy, right? I remember you saying that recently, Joe. Bench guy. I'll I'll I'll do get out for deadlift, Paulie: Right. Exactly. Joe Warpeha: I'll I'll take the bench if we're assigning Heather Faas: I'll take that squat. Paulie: Okay. No, I I don't know. Very few people say squats are their favorite. So maybe I'll I'll be squat because I I I feel like you know, I'm the biggest target here as far good and bad, so it's it's good. Exactly. Heather Faas: levers, the appropriate levers for squat. That could work. Josh Rohr: So so I guess Paulie: Exactly. Josh Rohr: I guess that leaves total, and I guess I'll take that one, which is the most important anyway. Paulie: There you go, Josh. Right. Assigning self importance. Heather Faas: Wait, dots, dots. I'm the lightest. Let's go. Josh Rohr: Yeah, there we go. so what I wanted to do is just kinda essentially kinda reintroduce all of you to our listeners because some of you some people may not know you yet and just kinda go from there. but before we do that, this was not necessarily planned, but this episode's coming out on the twenty fifth anniversary of nine eleven and I wanted to make sure we, you know, at least say something about that. So I thought maybe we would just kinda just for I guess People's curiosity what we were doing when we found out. Paulie, we'll start with you. Paulie: Sure. I had actually Becca and I had just actually arrived in Holland in Amsterdam. back then we were in the film industry and we were going there for to for a trade show actually to meet with a vendor and it's you know time difference it was almost three PM in in when we finally checked into our hotel room. And we got a call from our and we were exhausted because we, you know, took a red eye and couldn't check in, et cetera, et cetera. And we got a call from a German colleague who said, I'm so sorry, and we didn't know what was going on. We didn't expect anything to be going on. And he's like, you know, New York is just burning. New York is burning down. And this is like this is the the world perception, because it was it was it was we got that call right after the first plane hit and the second plane hadn't hit yet. Or around there. I think it was I remember and maybe my timing's off, but that's the way it felt. It was I think it was eight forty six in New York 'cause we got it at two forty six. And we we got the call and, you know, we turned on the T V and just watched. and there was nothing else that we could do at that point and eventually we were exhausted. We went we went to sleep. We And then just kind of stayed and you know, we were in Holland for a week. We actually stayed a c a couple days later longer because United States was trying to figure out how to let people back in or what they were doing. There was and and that was a whole process. but you know, one thing I would say is the the Dutch were very, very empathetic as we were moving around the city, lots of moments of silence and kind of respect for what had happened. and contextually w at that time, Becky and I lived in an apartment at the base of the Brooklyn side of the base of the Brooklyn Bridge. So the Brooklyn Bridge was used as the emergency corridor. And so day and night we'd hear sirens going over, you know, just back and forth over the bridge. And I think for a couple months, We could just smell the burning of the site because it was stated as one of the longest building fires ever, but it was it was very solemn, kind of life changing and obviously not forgotten. So that's my story. Josh Rohr: Mm, Joe, what about you? Joe Warpeha: So I was twenty five years old at the time. I was living in Saint Petersburg, Florida. That's where I had gone to college. And then after I graduated, I stayed and and worked. And I was actually at home that morning. it was a weekday, but I had just applied for a job. So a brand new big YMCA was opening up in Saint Petersburg and I had applied to be a personal trainer and they weren't opening up for a few weeks. So I was at home, you know, just kinda, you know, hanging out. and I'll never forget it. Yeah, I was the T V was on in the background, the news was on in the background. and I remember, you know, as soon as, you know, the news, you know, got it and, you know, they were showing the the images and and I remember, you know, kind of being glued to my television set like a lot of other people were that morning and just so many questions without really any answers other than we know, you know, this this first plane has hit the building and then at the time there's speculation was it some kind of an accident, you know, something like that and then the second plane hit and everything else kind of unfolded the rest of the morning there. So yeah, I I mean I'll I'll never forget it. We're all, I mean, the four of us here in about the same generation. So I think, you know, every generation has their that that one thing that they're never gonna forget. They're always gonna remember exactly where they were, what they were doing. And, you know, for for all of us here in this group, that was probably, you know, our thing. But yeah, I won't I won't forget that and and I won't forget what it was like flying only a couple weeks after that. I remember I was actually flying up to go compete in Bench Nationals, which I think was in Ohio that year. And so that was only a couple of weeks after 9 11. But you know, the the sky air traffic had been opened back up. People were traveling again. And I will say I don't think I've ever experienced such an eerie feeling walking through an airport, being in the airport, being on the airplane. Everybody looking at everybody else up and down. it was just a I mean, eerie is is the only term I can think to describe that. So, that's where I was on on that day. Heather Faas: Yeah, so I was pulling up to my job at the sports authority. I worked as a customer service rep there. And I just remember walking in and my manager is a jokester, so you never knew what he was gonna be doing. And it was super quiet, but they had the news coming on over the speakers, which was very odd. And so I thought they were actually playing some sort of like weird satire or something like Then there was going to be a punchline coming out just because it seemed so unreal. And I remember all of us employees being super confused. it was a very quiet day at work. we had decided to close early, but I remember every single customer that had walked through that day, we either hugged or had some sort of like positive interaction with each other. So, like the environment was completely different than usual, where it was, you know, you were on edge all the time with customer service and things. and it was just like we all connected in a completely different manner when we realized what was really happening. and then we actually closed early that day and just sent everybody home to be with their families because it was such an emotional experience for everyone. and I just remember sitting on the floor in my parents' house and none of us moved unless you had to run to the restroom. But it was like we were just glued to the TV as this continued to transpire and just Just in sheer just crying and the emotion of it all as as you were just watching all this continue to unfold. And so it was a very like somber, quiet, emotional state in our house for what felt like days and weeks, like you just couldn't believe what we were seeing happening was actually real life. so it was really sad and but to see communities come together and love on each other more than ever before through this tragedy. tragedy I think was just so such something that we should all continue to revert back to is that love that we saw come out in in that moment. so Josh Rohr: Yeah. Yeah. I was mowing hay in the middle of a field when I found out on my newly newly purchased flip phone. Somebody called me and told me. but yeah, that that was definitely a hard day. and you know to say about that but so let let's let's transition into a little bit just for the listeners to kind of understand a little bit more about how the the executive functions and maybe kind of what your specific roles are and how that how that works with the rest of the organization. So you know how do you guys interact with the the the rest of the EC state chairs committee chairs like how do how do we make sure everybody's on the same page and kind of start with each of you individually what your role is and I guess Paulie, just if you want to explain like what your what the presidency is, why it's important, like some of the tedious things that you can talk about. I know there's a lot you can't talk about, but just kind of give people a glimpse of kind of what that means to to be president. Paulie: Sure. you know, don't don't undersell this position either, Josh. It doesn't there's like i talking about tedious, it's not necessarily tedious. It's it's definitely work, but it's it's work that I feel very strongly about. It's work that I I want to do. there's the the presidency for USA powerlifting is unique in that the president is actually chairman of the board. and the board of directors, which we call the executive committee, and that's functionally the board of directors. And then we even have a larger board which we call the national governing board, which is technically all of the same board. so the and then the also the president in USA powerlifting, I would say the the clearest Or the way I see it and the way I've seen it is is kind of long term vision, is kind of creative vision as well and being able to look over the horizon and an idea of where. We think that the organization should go and where it should be say in in in say the next five years, ten years, and I often think in terms of fifty years. You know, in my mind I'm thinking about how this organization will thrive after I'm long gone. And and if I can kind of make a mark on it now. and you know, it's it's I wanna pause for a second and say when I say I I'm saying we but I'm talking about the the work that I do to work together to bring this together because that's that's something I've I've I've I've been aware of for a long time and it I think it comes it comes it comes to bear even more where you know as the president because I'm I'm one person and so I can present an idea, I can I can bring something forward, but then the next step is to to bring everybody together to see if this idea can actually function and see if it'll work. so I mean that's that's fundamentally the president's position and and just also being a spokesperson for the organization and as you know and and and receiving receiving feedback good and bad and learning from that feedback and and just kind of finding the best and clearest path forward. So you know that that's the I think that that's the president's definition. That's kind of my my view of it and my view of it kind of aligned with how it plays with everybody else. Josh Rohr: And you've been president for a little over a year now, right? Yeah. So how's how's how's the first year go? Would you would you give it a thumbs up or a thumbs down? Paulie: Well I will I will give it a thumbs up. I because I I mean I'm here and I I I did the work. I I've learned an incredible amount in this first year and something that, you know, I I'm very I'm very big on reflection. So I'm I'm constantly kind of looking back and taking a moment and considering how things have been done so that it can kind of inform path forward. And I think it's become clear that this first year, because I'm I'm the first president after the last president, Larry Malley, Dr. Larry Malley served for twenty two years. And so I think there were, you know, in a way, you know, you could look at his big shoes to fill or, you know, building my own pair of shoes and and kind of filling those. And so it's a combination it's been a combination of both. It's kind of moving moving Heather Faas: Okay. Paulie: forward beyond what has been for a very long time without corrupting or perverting the the core values of the organization and and also building trust. You know, I've been talking about that a lot lately and and just kind of building trust. amongst the board, amongst the, you know, all of the voting members and and just the members at large. And making sure that, you know, when we function as an organization, we are doing things that don't go against the grain. And if they do go against the grain, then we have a very strong explanation for it. And so those are those are some of the things I've learned. I mean we there was a lot that was accomplished in that first year. some very overt changes which were you know received mixed but but I think I think as time goes on the the sentiment shifts to positive. I mean you've been on the on the end of that as well Josh and you've you've shared your shall I say concerns about certain things with me and but also I think that you've also shared that over time you've seen the benefits of those changes. And I and I think, you know, one big takeaway from this, from my first year is just communicating, getting the word out, bringing people in, and and kind of making allowing not making, but just helping everybody Heather Faas: Yeah. Paulie: understand why we are doing Heather Faas: Yeah. Paulie: something and and listening if there's an issue. and I think I think a massive change was the way that we rolled out nationals where nationals we we we communicated deeply, repetitively and clearly with all of the involved constituents so that we would have full consensus before nationals was rolled out. So there are no surprises. Everybody was informed and and I think that the the the proof is in the pudding as far as the you know, there there hasn't been any backlash and it's been understood and our message is clear. The message of of one family and bringing the organization together, I think has been very positively received as opposed to other things that w that I kind of brought forth in the first year and they weren't as cleanly received. So I've learned a lot and I will continue to learn. Josh Rohr: Cool. Joe, so do you want to speak a little bit about I guess your role as vice president, kind of what that entails and yeah, open floor. Joe Warpeha: Yeah. you know, the president's job description is a very long list of of a lot of responsibilities. the vice president's list historically has been a very short list. So so the one thing that has typically been a major responsibility of the vice president is that's the person who oversees all of the committees in the organization. And we have a lot of different committees representing different constituencies of members, different specialty areas. etc. And so that's that's something that I mean if you go, you know, way back with the exception of a of a couple year period in time period of time, the committee chairs reported to the vice president. So that's on the the job description there. and I've been very excited to kind of get going on that. In terms of you know what's not necessarily on on the job description. I mean if you look at I mean I'm also like Paulie following Dr. Larry Maley, I'm following Johnny Graham who you know, was vice president for over twenty years. And a lot of our members have known nothing but Larry and Johnny as president and vice president. And so, I mean, I'll use the big shoes to fill, an analogy that Paulie did, but but Johnny Graham's shoes are are big shoes to to fill. he was often seen as kind of the the face of the organization because I don't think he missed a single national championship in all his time as as vice president. He he was the person that people were comfortable calling on the phone and talking to and asking questions or sharing concerns. I I very much want to be like Johnny in in that regard, being somebody that people feel comfortable calling on the phone and and talking to. I want people to feel like they can trust me when they share their concerns. They trust that I'm I'm gonna do the right thing with those concerns. And I I've had a lot of phone calls already in my first couple months on the job. And so I'm I'm really excited about, you know, continuing to do that. the committees, I I've got a lot of ideas about, you know, the the committees and just kind of standardizing structures, things like that. We we like I said, we have a lot of committees, different, you know, committees have some different internal structures, you know, how they run things. And my goal is not to micromanage the committees. My goal is just kind of get a sense of, okay, what what's your committee's purpose? How are committee members brought on board? what are the, you know, what's the term length of a committee member? How do we how are new chairs selected or elected depending on on the situation? So there's a lot to dig into there in terms of the committees, but that's something I've kind of started in the background and and excited about, you know, working through. We in my first couple months, we have two new committee chairs. So a lot of the people watching this podcast. if they've heard my name, they probably associate associate it with being the chair of the technical committee, which is something I did for for eight years. And then when I became vice president, I stepped away from that. So that left a vacancy on on the technical committee. And Tyler Gerfers is is now the the technical committee chair. So we we basically what I wanted to do, especially with that a as the first, you know, case, create a process and a procedure so for how are we going to replace, you know, committee chairs and You know, there's gonna be a a a solicitation ad out there, you know, this is what we're looking for. Here's the process, applications, a standardized procedure, and then a a way by which those people are are selected. So that that seemed to run very well with the technical committee chair situation. And we just recently appointed our our latest disabled athletes committee chair, Jordan Brond, who when Tyler Gerfer's moved over to technical committee chair. He was the longtime disab disabled athletes committee chair. He stepped away from that, leaving a vacancy in there. So we were able to repeat that procedure and it and it seemed seemed to work well. And that's that's kind of my goal is to get the processes Heather Faas: Yeah. Joe Warpeha: and procedures, you know, written down, applied, and standardized. And and there's a lot of work to do there. But I think that's going to be a a big chunk of what I'm spending my time on. I mean the bylaws will tell you you know, probably in any organization, you know, the vice president is there to step in if the president is not there. If, you know, Paulie weren't able to attend one of our monthly executive committee meetings, then I would take his place at that meeting. But if you look at a lot of organizations, you know, not related to powerlifting, a lot of times the vice president position is it's a figurehead position. It's a position that doesn't really have a lot of, you know, functional purposes behind it. And and I don't wanna be that. I don't wanna just be, you know, the name behind the position title. I mean, I wanna be involved. I I wanna, you know, use the information, the experiences that I've collected in my twenty seven years as a member. and so so that's the goal is to kind of, you know, streamline all of that and and kind of figure out, you know, with input from the leadership team, the executive committee, I mean, what makes sense for for the job description of the vice president and In terms of job descriptions, that's something organization wide we're working on. I mean, my my vision would be if you have a position in USA powerlifting, there's a job description associated with it. a lot of times when people come in into new positions, it's just kind of passed down from the previous person. Well, this is what I did and then this is what you should do. so I I think there's a lot of power in in having a very specific job description. So people know you know what they're what they're getting into. People know what the expectations are of that person, if they're meeting them, if they're not meeting them, et cetera. So, I I guess that kind of winds up, you know, what what my job is, what I see my job being, and that's what I've been up to in the first couple of months. Josh Rohr: Cool. Heather, what do you do? Heather Faas: So where I think Paulie and Joe's job descriptions may be long, mine is very broad, my super wide. And and where my just job job description really and my role is to take the executive committee's governance of the organization and their direction and then put it into action. So I oversee like the day to day operations of the national office and the organization, but a huge part of my job really is connecting all the different pieces for USA carlifting. So it it's not just this day to day thing that I do all the the same thing all the time. My every hour I'm dealing with some different aspect within the organization. So one minute I may be working on a national event and the next minute maybe working on our international team stuff. Maybe working through a state issue or working with a member who has some sort of concern. Maybe I'm connecting with partners or insurance companies, things of that nature. So a lot of my job really is figuring out how we take an idea or initiative or maybe something that is an organizational priority and actually making that happen and putting those pieces together. So I think Joe said it when I had a conversation a few months back was like I'm like the glue that kind of puts and holds the organization together. and so that's kind of how I like to. To think of my role here. and one of the biggest things that like when I came in is I wanted to see a little bit of an organizational shift for us, in that if I wanted us to be a resource for people at from the national office per sect perspective. So maybe you're a state chair, a meet director, an athlete or a referee, and you're trying to do something that's gonna help USA powerlifting. I wanted our first question to be like, how can we help? So I didn't want to be like a closed door or where we say, hey, all of those things are handled by the EC or the National Office or leadership. but I want to say, hey, how can we support you in making these initiatives that you feel are very important for our organization? How can we make that happen? And then also how can we remove like unnecessary or unnecessary barriers, help solve problems, and then like giving our volunteers and and our basically the base and structure of our organization, how can we give those people the tools that they need to help us continue to grow here in USA powerlifting as a whole? Josh Rohr: Awesome. So I want to circle back to something Paulie said earlier. And this is an open question to all of you. Paulie, you mentioned in in your in your your talk that there were a few changes that were rolled out, some with mixed reviews. Do you guys want to speak to any of those changes in case people aren't aware of them and kind of what maybe what they were? You can also pass if you want, but that was a that was a question. Paulie: Sure. No, I mean it's there's no listen, there there is always people always are talking about transparency. And I I think I think I've I've I've understand where people are coming from because I've always thought that I've been very transparent. And I think it's I think it's really about clarity and it's about understanding. I feel like the word transparency gets misused. in in thinking that, you know, every every single piece of how the sausage is made, like everything single element has to be exposed. But I think clarity is just kind of being clear on the steps that were taken to get there. And and that's something that, you know, th that was definitely a learning experience. And you know, the I think the the thing that comes to mind for me is drug testing. And you know, as far as I saw and the board saw, was that everything was done according to the bylaws and it was done according to the rules, but then there was this whole level of you know expectations from the NGB. And so there was pushback from the NGB as far as you know being informed or being included and so on and so forth. But there was nothing in the Bhylaws that clearly stated that that something should be done that way. It and there was an expectation that things should be done that way because they had been done that way. Josh Rohr: So can I ask can I ask for specifics because I I I feel like a lot of the people listening were not at the N G B meeting so they probably don't even realize what you're what you're referring to. Paulie: I'm not I mean I'm actually referring to it specifically. It's just the like the the mechanics of the expectations of how something was done. So there are there are two mechanisms for for changing policy or changing something in you know in in in USA powerlifting. And one way is to is for the executive committee to vote on it and to put it into play and And the other mechanism is that we have an annual national governing board meeting, which is essentially an expanded version of the board, where we have, I think our board technically is about 65 members, sits around there. And and that includes state chairs, committee chairs, athletes, reps, I think that's pretty much it, plus the plus the actual board. And just for context, In this case, Joe and I have a vote. Heather does not have a vote. The the operation side of things do not have votes. They're not technically part of that that constituency. So the expectation was that something like changing drug testing should have been brought to the NGB as opposed to the executive committee doing the work and and bringing the vote forward. And I know Josh you had that same thought. So I'm gonna I'm gonna push it back to you for a second and say like what is was that your expectation as far as Josh Rohr: Y well, my my question was more about the content the the context of why what was the change and why. I guess was more where I was coming from. So I guess that's that was also kind of my question to you just a minute ago, is what I was meaning. I just need to be more clear what I'm asking, I guess. So for for those that don't know, like what I mean, do you want to talk about the little bit of more detail of like what the actual yeah, the actual Paulie: so are you the the it's actual thing? Right. We moved Josh Rohr: thing. Paulie: we we moved we changed we changed or we consolidated to one drug testing lab. We we significantly expanded our drug testing panels and we reduced drug testing from ten percent to five percent. And sure. Right. And and Josh Rohr: Which on the surface sounds bad. I I've just put that out there. So like go ahead and explain, I guess. Paulie: so here's here's the part Ye and and the and I think that what we could have done is probably a better campaign in the beginning just to explain why we were doing these things. So it has the way that existed before, we we used two different labs and we were using one lab to do what we would what we considered at the time to be our you know the Wada lab and that had that has a an expanded drug testing panel. And for if we're if we're going full explanation, WATA is the World Anti Doping Agency. It's it's what most of Olympic you know Olympic sports use and it has its own set of rules and its own set of governance. on the local level we were testing using a different lab and that was basically a steroid panel. And that was it. And could so think about it more as a drug testing panel that was occupational. that you know, you might you might have that drug test if you're gonna go, you know, work work in a service organization or be a security guard, something like that. And you it was only testing for steroids. And so we were and we has our we have our ten percent drug testing where we and so we were satisfying at the local level by just By essentially using an outdated panel. And so we weren't really kind of addressing the changes in in the way that people were using or are using performance enhancing drugs. And then I I thought that there was a big, you know, I I don't think we were being truthful truthful as an organization and saying that we we were giving we had multiple standards for testing. And I think for for fairness. The test should be the same at every single level. And that's and just like our rules. Like we don't have multiple standards for our rules. We have one standard for our rules that are should be applied at every single level of competition. And so that was that was the change. catching more people by doing more tests. And a lot of times, you know, the first five five percent, if you will, were people that warranted being tested. And then the rest was filler. And I think for any meat director out there, even a referee who has been, you know, pulled in to do drug testing or anything, like there were times where, you know, people would be like, I don't know, we haven't tested this person in a while, let's test them. But there wasn't any kind of like rationale or reasoning behind it. And so so that's where that's where we brought things together. The other thing is that we we eliminated well we changed from having to do third party testing to creating our own doping control officer program, which they are separate from you know, w what we did was we separated them out from being a referee, so a referee wouldn't be on the platform and then coming forward and then doing a drug test, they were they became their own separate module, if you will. And that's been that's been very successful as we're growing. So that so we as that program is growing. So we we made a lot of changes and I think it it it kind of disrupted the status quo. as far as things go and people had been very attached to the ten percent number without really fully understanding what it meant. They they felt like the ten percent was kind of part of our lore and part of our legacy. And you know, if you talk to you know, for instance, Dr. Larry Malley was was behind the change. I had many conversations with him and, you know, he's been there since the beginning and he was behind the change, as far as as far as taking Josh Rohr: So so Paulie: the moving forward with this. Yeah. Josh Rohr: so so my my thing is like I wanna catch people cheating. So true or false, is this gonna catch more people cheating or not? That's not I didn't wear that. Paulie: It th I don't I don't think that's a fair question because it's like here's here's the thing. You I d I don't know. I it like I'm gonna I'm I'm answering this very honestly because I think there's two answers. I can give you a political answer and I can give you an honest answer. And I think that the the honest answer is that ultimately yes, because we are actually testing for the things that people are taking. So before we were not testing for peptides, we were not testing for all these designer concoctions that were that were you know we weren't testing for any of those at the local level. Now we're testing for everything at the at the local level. And that's honestly where we catch people. does this does this allow us to catch more people? Like like the the bet the way that we would catch more people is put every single person in the registr registered testing pool and and do out of meat testing and catch them when they're not expecting it or test them when they're not expecting it. But that is just financially un unviable. It's it's near impossible to do it. So our main mechanism is to test people at competitions. Part of the problem also is that people are getting very smart, and they have gotten very smart about how they take how they take these substances. And it's not it's not it's not the nineteen eighties, nineteen nineties anymore where You know, people would would be just be taking these kind of very, very broad steroids with very long shelf lives, and it would be very easy to catch. So so I think ultimately, yes, we will catch more cheaters. And as far as catching more people, I I can't tell you how many people are out there cheating. But we will catch more cheaters as far as that goes, because we are we are a lot more focused and and our net is. We got a much finer weave than what we had before. So we're not letting people just kind of slip through. But part of this Heather Faas: Yeah. Paulie: is that as word gets out about our testing, then what happens that people get smarter about how they cheat. And so it is always this cat and mouse game as far as this goes. So I don't know. Did Heather Faas: Yeah. Paulie: I answer your question, Josh? Josh Rohr: So you said yes, it will catch more cheaters. That was my that was the basis of my question. So yes. Paulie: Okay. You could reduce my very long answer. I mean, how how about this? I wanna I wanna I wanna kind of bring in bring in my colleagues here too. because, you know, they were they were they were part of this journey. Joe, what do you say? Joe Warpeha: So, you know, I think it it's worth giving the viewers kind of a glimpse behind the curtain and and what kind of goes on. And I'm not giving any way anyway like proprietary secrets or anything, but we don't always agree on things as a board. and I mean Josh, you having been on the EC before, you know that. Like like we don't all just, you know, somebody suggests something, we all think it's a great idea, we do it. Like like we disagree on on plenty of things. We try to disagree agreeably. and and get along and and move forward. But on on this particular matter, I would have called myself a a hardliner 10% for drug testing, because that's all I ever knew. And I do think this is a good subject considering we're we were founded as the American Drug Free Power Thing Association. And that's all I ever knew. I thought, you know, 10% that's a good, that has a good deterrent effect, et cetera. And when this was first presented, you know, to the EC. my immediate reaction was no, we we can't we can't go down from from ten percent. But I I try to always be open to to new ideas and this on my own research, like like went to see like like what actual research has been published on this particular topic. and and as somebody who's a college professor, that's often the first thing I I do is go out there and see what what's actually out there in the literature. And and there wasn't a lot, but I did find one one study that it it convinced me. that that maybe ten percent isn't the magic number, maybe more is not better. The idea of more targeted testing, more focused testing. I think anybody who's a meet director that's that's watching this or like like Paulie said a referee who's done drug tests knows, you know, it it's maybe not that often that you're selecting something for drug testing that you're thinking, yep, that's that's the person right there. I mean, I I stopped counting the number of drug tests that I I performed after three or four hundred of them. I did a lot of them in Minnesota over the years. And and a lot of times it was a matter of we gotta hit the ten percent. So let's just pick this person, that person. Like Paulie said, we haven't tested that person in a while, but we have to test somebody. and I think of of all the the hundreds of tests that that I was the the collection person for, maybe five or fewer actually failed their drug test. and I would say looking back, like I was fairly convinced that that was going to be a positive test. So So, you know, I changed my mind on the numbers, but I will say the one thing that that I disagreed on is I thought procedurally in in my mind, I thought this should be an NGB vote. because I think, you know, in my mind, you know, the EC is there, you know, to to kind of run things 364 days a year when the NGB's not in session. If there's something that's an urgent matter that can't wait till the next NGB, the the EC has those those powers in the bylaws. And in my opinion was, well, This isn't an urgent crisis, you know, I I think you can wait till the next NGB meeting. I I was in the minority. and and when the vote came down, I 100% accepted it and said, okay, this is what we're doing. But but I very much did change my stance on, you know, Heather Faas: Yeah. Joe Warpeha: the the ten percent versus five percent. I think it it makes sense to me, you know, just based on on what I looked into. and and really the final answer is time will tell. You know, once we've had this, you know, a full year or two years, we'll see. And the good news is You know, we're not locked into this for the next ten or twenty years. We can always make changes. You know, we can we can evolve if we think going back to the way it was before is better. I mean, we can always do that. So it's not like we made this decision and it's permanent. So I think that's that's the other other news here. But yeah, that was kind of my my take on the the whole thing as we went through that in the past year. Paulie: I you know, I'll I'll throw something back in there and then, you know, I'd I'd love to hear what Heather has to say also, just because Heather's deeply involved with this and a a part of hearing it from all sides as well, is the R one thing that that we wanna that we're looking to fix, and this is this is a little bit you know, I've talked about this a little bit and you know, we're gonna bring it up more. is the the mechanism of voting in my opinion at the NGB is flawed because based on you know the the truth is that like something like changing something as consequential as drug testing where it it is seen as as like our main pillar as Joe said it's in it's in our original name is that you know, it it wouldn't have gotten the s the service that it needed at the NGB, where t like realistically you have less than ten minutes to make a decision on a vote. And, you know, following Robert's rules and, you know, you've got five minutes, you can extend five minutes and then then you got a vote. And the concern is that the vote would not be a rational vote at the NGB. the vote would be an emotional vote based on what people feel, whereas soon as like we all grew up with ten percent. We all believed it. I I I actually I've I I've asked Larry this. I asked Larry years ago why. And he said, you know, we just kept raising the number until we felt like it was enough of a deterrent. You know, 'cause like you know, things were tried like, you know, blood testing, polygraph testing. Like all of these different things. And we were it just kind of as pioneers in drug free sport, you know, going back forty five years ago, kind of feeling around in the dark. And so this is just kind of where it landed and it just became more. Because the idea was that, you know, this was ten percent would be enough to make people think twice about coming forward or or coming out to you know, com coming into coming to a a a competition. you know, on gear. and and so so it wasn't in my mind there wasn't even a strong enough argument, historical argument for for holding 10%. Again, but we're messing with lore. We're messing with, you know, the the the the history of the sport and those get intermingled. And so so one of the things that that we're working on doing is to ultimately allow for voting throughout the year, where we can have longer format discussions on deeper topics such as this and and allow for longer consideration so that the work that's being done is kind of properly reflected in the vote and not necessarily having you know, just five, ten minutes to make a decision, because this took months and months of work to build into this, of research and of kind of building the program and coming back and building the program again. and it's constantly it's that same kind of reflection and iteration as far as working to improve. And I can tell you that you know, everybody behind the scenes are are constantly working to improve this. So that that was some of that that's that's transparency. That's that's kind of giving clarity on on why this these decisions were made to do it this way. But I also have learned to kind of bring more people in more frequently and and more openly so that so that that we get you know rounded feedback and and we get you know more you know just just more clarity on both sides. So you know that's that's that's kind of a quick addendum there. But, you know, Heather what are you seeing there? Heather Faas: Yeah, I think you just actually hit the nail on the head because I was kind of in between the two as far as when this was rolling out and my perspective on either how how I felt about it and how it was going to be taken when it came out. I had this like gut-wrenching, like, this could be bad when it was getting ready to release. I I understood from more of like I saw the financial perspective of it and how much we were more or less bleeding by trying to run all these tests third party. And and not catching as many people as we thought we were gonna catch with the 10%. But then also saw like in the end, we were s well surpassing the 10%. so wh why we were caught up on this 10% didn't make much sense. And I think we even saw it when we first rolled it out at the Arnold, while we have this 5% that we were trying to hit, we well per you know past the 5% at that one meet alone. And so we I think we're probably going to surpass the 10% by the end of the year. So I think that is one thing that we can look at is just because we've said 5% is the minimum, we don't stop at 5%. We keep testing. And because our tests are more geared towards what we are seeing rolling out, we will catch more people cheating because we are prepared for that now. and then, you know, talking on the communication side of things. So I think one of the big things that we've had to learn is we can as leadership cannot operate in these silos. Joe can't operate on his own, Paulie, the EC, myself. we have to be very open with communication. and although a very healthy leadership, it's good that we like disagree on things and we bring in these different perspectives so we can see it all from all sides. We communicate those differences. But then once we have our decision, we move forward as a collective unit and supporting an initiative that we push forward. One thing we are getting better at and Paulie is, you know, has already alluded to this multiple times is that we learned that we can't just communicate a decision. we have to be much more prepared to start these conversations sooner with our our NGB and our state chairs and those people that will great more greatly impact our committee chairs. have those com those conversations sooner and earlier so we can get their perspectives and actually have them involved in that decision-making process as well, so that they can be included in more of that, all of the conversations because. Us as leadership, we see all of those conversations. So we understand the why and the problem that we're trying to solve. But if a decision is just handed down to you and you haven't been involved in any of the conversations, or maybe one, you can't fully grasp that overall perspective and problem that we are trying to solve. And we really are trying to make something better. We're not trying we wouldn't want to make things harder for people. I that just literally doesn't make any sense. But we can understand the frustration from people when the full concept is not. presented and presented soon enough. So we we are working through that, creating some processes so things aren't released haphazardly and just the decision itself comes down. We're gonna really work on creating all of that communication sooner. Paulie: I'll I'll I'll throw something out 'cause this is the irony and this is something that that I've I've I've learned that there like you know there's nothing you know I think conspiracies arise and this idea that, you know, we're doing things untoward if there's not that clarity there. And I think that's and and there's there's not communication. The truth is a like you know, kind of you you stated this at the beginning. It's like there there's a lot of tedium in just kind of working through policy and making sure that we're doing things right. And and I think we just need to be like we just have to remember to share that with people because it's not it's not this kind of deliberate hiding of anything. But I think if people are not included appropriately, as as as Joe and Heather have said, then of course they're gonna, you know, default to thinking that we're doing something for some other agenda. And the truth is that we're not. And that's our kind of and and again, maybe sharing more, but that's that's an internal frustration. That that when something pops up and we haven't messaged it properly and we know that there's nothing nefarious there, we kind of just, you know, it's like I'm kicking I'm kicking myself because we didn't take the proper steps to better communicate something, that there was nothing nothing shady going on. And again, once we communicate clearly and and if we can do that from the beginning, and that's a learning process for all of us, then then we then we don't get that pushback. There's this understanding. Or if there's something that we missed or something that's glaring, then then we are informed and educated, and then we can go and correct because we we are here to work for the organization. So I think that that's something that like I know it's kind of like you know, the the the OSHA signs that say X amount of days since our last accident. And, Heather Faas: Yeah. Paulie: you know, it's like for me, I I I just need a sign that says X amount of days since our last social media eruption. And and it just Heather Faas: Yeah. Paulie: 'cause I know that if we're saying it right and if we're doing it right, then that that that we'll get into the triple digits, you know, maybe even four digits by the time you know, I retire from presidency or whatever. But I I really want there to be this kind of Like I I don't need we like I don't want blind following, but I think if if we build consensus properly, then then we have clear understanding, a majority understanding, and people don't feel compelled to say maybe lash out at us on social media and they they know that they can come talk to us or or what have you. So Joe Warpeha: So just a couple of quick things I'll add for our viewers who who might not be real familiar with our our testing process. when we say five percent or ten percent, those aren't the numbers that it ends up with ends up at the end of the year. So I'm gonna go back to ten because the math is easier, but you know, when we always said ten percent, if you had fifty lifters and a meet, that means you're gonna do five tests. But as soon Heather Faas: Okay. Joe Warpeha: as it goes up to fifty-one, if you did five tests, that's less than ten percent. And we always said it's a minimum of ten percent. So it always rounded up. And so, well, yes, you know, five is is half of ten, you know, in terms of the the new threshold for minimal testing, it's gonna end up probably being six, seven, maybe upwards of eight percent of of all, you know, lifters. Okay. Paulie: Higher. Higher. Yeah. Joe Warpeha: So So there's that piece, just so people are kind of aware of that. And the other piece, and and I always I was always glad that President Malley would regularly bring this up at the NGB because there's a lot of confusion over over testing and how do we select people. It's not random. It's never been random. We've never called it random. we are trying to catch people who are cheating. It's not to say that it's not random at times when I don't know who to pick. Like they just nobody's jumping out at me. So we gotta pick somebody. So that's gonna be random. But there's nothing random about it. So I just want to kind of reiterate that to the the people maybe who are new to the organization or don't quite understand how our how our drug testing works. Josh Rohr: So the intent is again going back to what the organization was founded on, like correct me if I'm wrong, the intent is to keep a cleaner platform. Yes? No? Yes. Heather Faas: Yes. Paulie: Yeah. Josh Rohr: Got it. Heather Faas: Unanimously yes. Yes. Paulie: A fair a fair and clear clear platform clean platform. And and you know, the because we can't there's no way we can ever guarantee like the grail is to be drug free. But as as with anything with stakes and human nature, people are gonna cheat. And so there's always gonna be a cheater out there, somebody who's just trying to get an edge for whatever reason. I think it's just how as human beings we're wired. Josh Rohr: Which is why we actually have to test, right? If it was just on our system we wouldn't have to. Cool. Paulie: Exactly. Exactly. And we we see because we can't just say to somebody, have you been a have you been a good lifter and yes or no and that's it? Because you know, cheaters are liars. And you know, as as we've see and like well it's it's different elsewhere. And and I'll kind of leave it there. And we c you know, you can see you can see the numbers of it. But I think I think our so just our catch rate is is sometimes between one and like zero and two percent. It's it no ma and that's that's kind of a a standard and that's expected. And so we're talking about maybe moving things by half a percentage point to expand like how we're how we're catching. And we're very you know we're open with these numbers. we were testing upwards I think of you know Probably like fourteen percent, sometimes fifteen percent. And at our bigger meets, as you know, Heather shared like last year at the Arnold where we, you know, where we rolled it out, and because the like the Masters event was co-sanctioned with the IDFPA, everybody went for world records and everybody got world records. And so part of the part of the plan is to test any record breakers. And so we just it it went crazy. But we we held true to our promise. Like it like as far as like just testing, testing, testing, but but in our minds, it also validate validates those records because now those records have been set and they have been tested. And in like that to me, I think is an important thing for an athlete to say that hey, not only did I break this record, but I have actual proof that I did it. as a drug free lifter. And I think that that is, you know, that's immense. And I think that's that's a commitment that that USA powerlifting makes to its athletes, the athletes that choose to compete with us. Josh Rohr: Awesome. Yeah. So I think that was a pretty good discussion on on the drug testing and some of the how the how things work behind the scenes, because I think a lot of people just aren't aware of how that works. So I appreciate you guys sharing all that. but let's shift gears a little bit. it's regional season. so Heather Faas: Pew Josh Rohr: yeah. So we have five different regional championships that are happening. November fourth November what month is this? September fourth through ninth. Heather Faas: Yeah. Josh Rohr: Last weekend was South Southwest Regionals. Next weekend we actually have two regional meets, the Midwest regionals in Appleton, Wisconsin, and the West Coast regionals in Las Vegas, Nevada. September nineteenth and twentieth is Southeast Regionals in Raleigh, North Carolina. And October sixteenth through eighteenth is the Northeast Regionals in Edison, New Jersey. what do you guys thoughts on regionals as a whole? Heather Faas: I am loving the excitement coming out about regionals. People are using it as stepping stones to national qualifiers. we're seeing pro cars rolling out. I'm seeing some money being went won in places, but just the excitement. It's like national, just before national level. Like it's it's super cool to see people getting pumped about regionals. and you know, we got two pro Two new pro card winners this past weekend. So we saw Felipe Sarkis with a 533 dots. Incredible performance. And then Morgan Rebernick. She came out with a 485 dots. So these people hit a minimum dots level and they were the winners overall. And so it was really cool to see their performances coming out. And I would be shocked if they don't show up at nationals and absolutely show out and take the stage for sure. really cool performance by Braden Hall. He was the best male junior lifter, and he actually came in second place for the open male lifters. So keep an eye on this guy. He hit a 526 dots. So he was giving Felipe a run for his money there. And then Izzy Deller, she was our best female junior with a 447 dot. So again, she's coming in right behind some of our open lifters, too. So keep an eye on these guys. We're gonna see them. they could be coming to collegiates or they could come to open nationals or nationals and really take over the platform. So keep an eye out for these guys. Josh Rohr: Awesome. Paulie, what are your thoughts on on the regionals as a whole? Paulie: Well, actually as as we're thinking about it, it might be ten years since Regionals was was rolled out. And you know, for I think some people out there know, but many don't, is that I I was the one who brought this this current format of regionals to to life. And and it ha and it so it make it gives me a little bit of like again reflection of of saying, well, hey, I had I had a vision, like I thought that something was missing in USA powerlifting. I reached out to leadership at the time and which which then responded and said, All right, well, do it. Start st get it started. And and that's kind of honestly what I hope to see from more people out there. So that's a little plug to to get involved. But it also makes me think about how long it takes something to to come to fruition. So it's only been in the couple last couple of years where we're seeing these big numbers. I think you know looking looking at some the numbers we have you know one thousand three hundred and forty nine lifters signed up. and you know north northeast is always the most stacked. I always like to think about it as is kind of because it's it's got some of the longest running history in powerlifting as being close to where you know historically powerlifting began. you know last year we had f o over 400 this year we have over three hundred competing at regionals and you know no other you know like every other region you know is over 200 close to 300. So that's that's amazing. And that just means that people are coming out and they're The the whole idea of regionals was always to have national level competition at like more accessible to athletes. And this is this is really again about putting athletes first and giving them plenty of opportunities to compete at the level that they want to compete in the way that they want to compete and giving them this this flexibility. And and it's just I I think I think we're hitting our stride. with regionals and and it's just it it really warms my heart and also is a good reminder that you know like I have to be patient with things as as as a as the president, as a human being, because it's taken a while to get here. But you know, with patience and persistence and and kind of like nurturing this along, we have gotten here. And and to be very clear, a couple of years ago I you know the there was a point where there was no reason for me to be involved in building regionals and that's where you know we dissolved the committee and gave it to the national office. So now more or less I'm hands off. And I think that's the way that we should be operating these things, right? I don't need to I don't like I it it grows now it grows because it's it's its own thing and that's where you know it's like kick kick the baby bird out of the nest and and you know, let it spread its wings and and I feel like regionals is you know, spreading its wings. I think our members get it. I think they understand. I think there's excitement about competing there. And, you know, I'll I'll throw it to Joe for some perspective. Joe Warpeha: I'm gonna start with some historical perspective since Paulie mentioned history and kind of the Northeast being, you know, going very deep in the history of powerlifting. and we're just you know, today is September tenth. It was September fourth, nineteen sixty five, that I think all histor historians universally agree is the first ever national powerlifting championship run in York, Pennsylvania. you know, York Barbell, Bob Hoffman. And so we're sixty year sixty-one years on in terms of kind of the the formal birth of the sport. So so the the Northeast is in fact kind of where where it all got started there. In terms of of our our regionals in in USA powerlifting, as Pauluded to, we're about 10 years into that. I I've always had a connection to our regional meets. the second year we had regionals, I ran our regional meet. That was the first you know, larger meet that I ever ran, I always, you know, ran local meets, but that was the first one in a hotel ballroom, et cetera. It's been really cool to kind of watch the evolution of the regional championships. I I mean, we've we've had some figuring out to do. We started, you know, as some of you will remember with different regions. I think we went back to the original regions, you know, from a long, long time ago and we gave that a try and and we kind of saw that it made more sense to consolidate some things and put certain states in the same region because of their natural connectedness. And and I think we we've gotten past all of that and and we're in good place now. And the numbers have continued to increase for the regional championships. And what's been really fun to watch is just the production value of the meats themselves. I mean, if you look at the production value of of all of our regional championships now, it's what our national championships were just a few years ago. So it's really cool to watch not only the number of lifters increase, the quality of lifting increase, but also the quality of the production. increase as we kind of, you know, work through that. And I think one of the last little things we had to tweak with the the regional system is the calendar. It's always something we've kind of struggled to figure out, you know, where should state champion because we all these di all these different levels of of, you know, championships beyond, you know, local meets and where should the state meets be, where should the regional meets be, national meets